22 replies to this topic

[jcpops]

I saw that welovejapan is providing guided tours at Kagura. If anyone has done it, I'm really curious what the experience was like. I'm assuming the guide is English speaking (my Japanese is terrible!). Does anyone know who or what company is doing the actual guiding service, and how much it costs? Cheers!

[tsondaboy]

Do you have any BC gear of your own or you are thinking about a tour so that you can rent all the equipment necessary?
Sorry, I ve never taken a guided tour up there.

[wakaran]

Those guys are amateurs, and in fact don't do it themselves. My friends had no end of hassle and a generally very bad experience.

I would go direct with Canyons (Minakami, but do Kagura, info on this site) if I were you without question.

[jcpops]

Hi Wakaran, that's a surprise. I know next to nothing about the backcountry or tours so don't know where to start. If you don't mind my asking, what would be the difference between the tour your friend signed up for, and the Canyons one? Thanks.

[wakaran]

Canyons is a professional backcountry touring company.
That's what they do and they're good.

The info page on here can be found here:
http://www.snowjapan.com/e/services/canyons.html

[jcpops]

Hi wakaran, thank you for the reply. Do you really think I need a guide for Kagura? From the photos I looked at on this website, it doesn't look very steep. I'm thinking of the hill that everyone rides on (I think the "Joshua Tree??" is on it). Just looks like a super big hike though!

[snowdude]

Yeah Canyons are good, I haven't done a tour with them, but they do seem to have a good reputation and I have been over to their place a few times. A mate of mine works there.

The 'WeloveJapan' group sorry I can't comment on them as I have never heard of them let a lone used them.

[jcpops]

Originally Posted By: tsondaboy

Do you have any BC gear of your own or you are thinking about a tour so that you can rent all the equipment necessary?
Sorry, I ve never taken a guided tour up there.

Hi Tsondaboy, I don't have any BC gear so that's one reason I was thinking of a tour. But a friend told me that when Kagura opens the very top lift in spring then alot of people just make an hour hike to the top. Sounds brilliant to me!

Sounds like a totally newbie question but if you didn't take a tour in the beginning how did you get started in the Kagura BC? Cheers!

[tsondaboy]

I first bought all the gear and hiked with some of the kagura regulars for the first year. I have never hiked without BC gear.

[torihada]

I had my first BC experience (and so far only BC experience ) with Canyons at Kagura. You can read about it here: Canyons BC trip report

They were great and a good part of the two day trip was learning about the dangers off the piste. I wouldn't ride out there without BC gear? To hike above Kagura you have to fill out a form with ski patrol (correct me if I'm wrong). If you want to get some BC experience, go with Canyons. They'll show you exactly how to ride safely off piste, and then try to drown you in chest high powder Aso their lodge at Minakami is excellent and the guides there are pretty chilled.

[jcpops]

Hi torihada, some brilliant photos there! Were most of the other people you saw up there also with a guide?

Also, if you don't mind me asking, what kind of tips did they give you about riding safely off the piste? Even a total newbie has to start somewhere.

[Rag-Doll]

Originally Posted By: jcpops

Originally Posted By: tsondaboy

Do you have any BC gear of your own or you are thinking about a tour so that you can rent all the equipment necessary?
Sorry, I ve never taken a guided tour up there.

Hi Tsondaboy, I don't have any BC gear so that's one reason I was thinking of a tour. But a friend told me that when Kagura opens the very top lift in spring then alot of people just make an hour hike to the top. Sounds brilliant to me!

Sounds like a totally newbie question but if you didn't take a tour in the beginning how did you get started in the Kagura BC? Cheers!

jcpops - I might get flamed for this but you can do the hills around Kagura without avie gear and without guides so long as you stay on the resort side of the hills that surround the resort. It is all pretty tame stuff really. Also, unless you're super early you'll find a stream of people heading up to the top so no danager of getting lost. The one condition though is that you climb and ride back into the resort. If you ride away from the resort without proper BC gear and a bloody good idea where you're going, you're crazy. But back into the resort is a piece of cake. Snowshoes or skins and a back pack with some munchies and water is about all you need. From the top lift to the top of the hills is only about 40min walk - there is only a short pitch that is steepish, the rest is a stroll. Two easy routes - From the top lift you can either go up and right and come down through the gully back to the top of the Kagura gondola (not to be confused with the Mitsumata ropeway) or go up from the top lift and go left and come down to the Tashiro-Kagura link chair. Skiiers right on Tashiro side has a very steep drop but so long as you stay on the Kagura side of the ridge, it is a doddle. Lots of fun in fairly tame terrain.

[jcpops]

Hi Rag-Doll, thank you for the advice, sounds like you have spent many a good day up there!

You've got me interested, though, what happens if you somehow ride away from the resort-side? Do you ultimately come out to some sort of river crossing or something?

I wish there was some sort of guide or something showing all this!

[Rag-Doll]

It was my go-to-place back in the day.

The reverse sides of the hills that surround Kagura are very steep and are serious no go areas for people who don't know what they are doing. There is plent of terrain to explore withinthe Kagura bowl and there is no reason why you should accidently find yourself out of that area and on to the reverse slopes.

Keep in mind that you're going to be in unpatrolled areas in sub-zero temps. If you stuff it up, you're in big trouble so keep a healthy dose of common sense and let self preservation be your guide.

[Rag-Doll]

One more thing - to actually answer your question, river crossings are only part of your concern, there is a massive increase in avie danger, it is significantly more difficult to walk out and finally, you could end up anywhere. The hills around that area are very steep - I think navigation, even in the summer, would be pretty difficult for a new comer. Cover the ground with a couple of meters of snow (lots of deep, soft fresh stuff too) and add in low vis and quickly reducing light, a bit of avie action, maybe a broken limb or even broken gear and it is good-night-nurse.

For a fun day at Kagura - climb the hill, turn around, strap in and head back into the resort - repeat, repeat again. Even if you don't want to do that there are heaps of tree runs that enable to basically ride trees and lifts all day with hardly any piste time. there is no need to go too far out of bounds.

[tsondaboy]

Originally Posted By: jcpops

Hi torihada, some brilliant photos there! Were most of the other people you saw up there also with a guide?

Also, if you don't mind me asking, what kind of tips did they give you about riding safely off the piste? Even a total newbie has to start somewhere.

I have a minimum requirement for a beacon/prob/shovel and beacon search skills for anyone that rides/wanna ride with me. Regardless if I we are planing to hit 40 deg slopes or 20 deg trees.
Asking for info before heading out is a really good mentality.

A good starting point is Bruce Jamienson's book "Free Riding in Avalanche Terrain". Only 18 pages and you can pick it up for only 8$ from amazon. Once you ve gone through it, you ll be probably out in the shops looking for gear.

[jcpops]

Thanks again for all the tips rag-doll and tsondaboy. That's a whole lot to think about definitely. Can't see myself jumping into right away, but it's nice to have goals!

I searched for 'kagura' in the photo-section and found some photos of the area which I think you are possibly talking about. If you don't mind another of my questions, is this the area you are referring to as somewhat safe? Sorry in advance if it's a stupid question.

[Rag-Doll]

I would say those areas are out range for the novice BC day tripper. They look nice but the slide areas would be nasty. If those ridges are where I think they are, then they're at least one ridge line over from where you can ride back in to the resort. Who took them, Tsonda are they yours?

[tsondaboy]

Its from muikas gallery.
That area is about 3.5 km from the top lift, about 2 hours hike I would say.

[Mamabear]

Is that a big fracture I spy in the centre of the 2nd pic?

I would say a pic like that would be a big warning to a novice to stay clear - at least without full avie gear, a competant guide team, and some BC safety training!!

I would think that there is an awful lot of easily accessible, relatively safe off-piste stuff in most Japan resorts to get you started. Like Rag-Doll said - top lift, hike some, turn around and head back through the resort and repeat. If you want more adventurous then you should really invest in gear and training.