#268866 - Sun Apr 27 200805:23 PMRe: F1 2008
[Re: SG]
frannyo
SJ'er with 1000+ posts
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Posts: 1521
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Grid for Spain.
Hamilton - is his star fading already or just a blip?
1. Kimi Raikkonen (Fin) Ferrari 1 min 21.813 secs 2. Fernando Alonso (Spa) Renault 1:21.904 3. Felipe Massa (Brz) Ferrari 1:22.058 4. Robert Kubica (Pol) BMW Sauber 1:22.065 5. Lewis Hamilton (GB) McLaren - Mercedes 1:22.096 6. Heikki Kovalainen (Fin) McLaren - Mercedes 1:22.231 7. Mark Webber (Aus) RedBull - Renault 1:22.429 8. Jarno Trulli (Ita) Toyota 1:22.529 9. Nick Heidfeld (Ger) BMW Sauber 1:22.542 10. Nelsinho Piquet (Brz) Renault 1:22.699 11. Rubens Barrichello (Brz) Honda 1:21.049 12. Kazuki Nakajima (Jap) Williams - Toyota 1:21.117 13. Jenson Button (GB) Honda 1:21.211 14. Timo Glock (Ger) Toyota 1:21.230 15. Nico Rosberg (Ger) Williams - Toyota 1:21.349 16. Sebastien Bourdais (Fra) Toro Rosso - Ferrari 1:21.724 17. David Coulthard (GB) RedBull - Renault 1:21.810 18. Sebastian Vettel (Ger) Toro Rosso - Ferrari 1:22.108 19. Giancarlo Fisichella (Ita) Force India - Ferrari 1:22.516 20. Adrian Sutil (Ger) Force India - Ferrari 1:23.224 21. Anthony Davidson (GB) Super Aguri - Honda 1:23.318 22. Takuma Sato (Jpn) Super Aguri - Honda 1:23.496
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#268870 - Sun Apr 27 200807:43 PMRe: F1 2008
[Re: frannyo]
SG
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Registered: Fri Jan 03 2003
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The 2008 McLaren isn't the best car on the grid, its not even second at the moment. its a blip. Hamilton is an amazingly talented driver. At the very moment the best car is Ferrari > BMW Sauber > McLaren.
Alonso fluked the second on the grid (read - he was on light fuel load, so look for him to be the first to pit for fuel in the race). He has been struggling all season in a woeful car. Alonso is undeniably a great driver, as too Hamilton, yet if they don't have a fast car they cant do much. Massa isn't in the top 5 drivers, maybe lucky to be in the top 10 for skill and talent, but he is in fast car and it makes him look good. Most of the drivers on the grid would excel in the Ferrari Massa is lucky to find himself in.
SG
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How about Kovy's stack? spearing into the tire wall at 240kph (at 26 G's)and he was unhurt, no broken bones only a slight concussion. Amazingly tough the driver cacoon of the modern F1 car. Kubica's horror satck last year and then Sunday's massive prang and both drivers all but walked away from them.
"For him to come out of it, then it's just another great example of what has happened with safety over the years," Sir Jackie Stewart said. "If it had been in my day he wouldn't have walked away from that. Not a hope in hell. Watching it and seeing how deeply it was buried was just atrocious. It's a miracle really because there was no deceleration at all. The car just went straight."
soubriquet
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JYS was very unpopular in his day due to his outspoken criticism of track safety. He was instrumental at the start of the process of getting improvements made so the F1 death rates have fallen from 1-2 dead per year to one every decade. His team-mate, Francois Cevert was literally cut in half when he hit the barrier at Watkins Glen.
The two elements to safety are the tracks and the cars. JYS fixed the former. Alain Prost nailed it when he praised the McLaren MP4-1 as a quantum leap in driver safety. McLaren pioneered the switch from aluminium honeycomb to carbon fibre construction. If you watch video of Villeneuve's fatal accident, you can see him being thrown across the track still belted in to his seat and the Ferrari's rear bulkhead. The car broke up around him. Carbon fibre tubs don't do that.
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SG
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indeed I read all about Stewart's safety crusade, that Villeneuve crash was evil, you could see him get literally crucified on the netting fence at the end of the accident.
Track safety used to be so slack. Roger Williamson at Zandvort (crap marshals), Tom Pryce at Kyalami (even crappier marshals). Jochen Rindt (crap safety barriers) leading to their deaths. The safety precautions taken now are light years ahead of 25+ years ago
soubriquet
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Oops. I was wrong about carbon fibre tubs. I drove Italian cars for more than 20 years because I like the way they drive. I've never been a Ferrari fan though.
Would you buy a second-hand car from this man?
A bit of double-sided tape will soon fix this up.
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If you can`t fix it with a hammer, it`s an electrical fault.
#269320 - Thu May 01 200808:14 PMRe: F1 2008
[Re: BagOfCrisps]
SG
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there are some crashes which will almost always be fatal no matter how safe the equipment, even a 2008 F1 car would struggle with the physics of the following annihilation.
*Warning* a shocking accident, where a car and it's driver completely and utterly disintegrate
Gordon Smiley in the 1982 Indy 500, ignoring the advice of his older wiser peers, by counter steering slides on the banked oval got caught out at 330kph and ploughed straight into the concrete wall. He had done it (counter steer) several times and gotten away with it before his fatal wreck, but the law of averages caught up with him big time
Quote:
"During an attempt to qualify for the Indy 500, Gordon Smiley, a cocky young driver from Texas, was determined to break 200 mph or die trying. Several veteran drivers...had warned him that he was in way over his head, driving all wrong for the Speedway. Smiley was a road racer and was used to counter-steering his car to avoid a crash if the rear wheels broke traction.
While rushing to the car, I noticed small splotches of a peculiar gray substance marking a trail on the asphalt leading up to the driver. When I reached the car, I was shocked to see that Smiley's helmet was gone, along with the top of his skull. He had essentially been scalped by the debris fence. The material on the race track was most of his brain. His helmet, due to massive centrifugal force, was literally pulled from his head on impact...I rode to the care center with the body. On the way in I performed a cursory examination and realized that nearly every bone in his body was shattered. He had a gaping wound in his side that looked as if he had been attacked by a large shark. I had never seen such trauma." (Rapid Response, pp 98-99)Dr Steve Olvey, Indycar Medical Director between 1979 and 2003,.
#269486 - Sat May 03 200805:16 PMRe: F1 2008
[Re: snowbender]
soubriquet
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The broken Ferrari is reputed to be the repaired tub from the accident where Schumacher broke his leg (1999?). That is disputed though, although apparently it is from the same series.
McLaren introduced the MP4/1 in 1981. Smiley's 1982 Indy accident would have been in an aluminium honeycomb car. You can see it telescope as it hits the wall. I wouldn't claim that carbon fibre would have saved him, but it would have offered better protection.
_________________________
If you can`t fix it with a hammer, it`s an electrical fault.
#269500 - Sun May 04 200809:28 AMRe: F1 2008
[Re: soubriquet]
SG
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Registered: Fri Jan 03 2003
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Andrea de Crasheris? He didn't finish too many races did he?
awful lot of "Ret" in his career chart. You wonder how someone with such a mediocre career managed to last so long.
In he mid 90's there was Ukyo Katayama who had an equally mediocre career. He became a folk-hero on a weekly sports chat show in NZ called 'TAB sports cafe', they finished their weekly round up of the news with Katayama crashing, it was their running joke and he obliged by providing plenty of content.
1. Felipe Massa (Bra) Ferrari one minute, 27.617 secs 2. Heikki Kovalainen (Fin) McLaren-Mercedes 1:27.808 3. Lewis Hamilton (GB) McLaren-Mercedes 1:27.923 4. Kimi Raikkonen (Fin) Ferrari 1:27.936 5. Robert Kubica (Pol) BMW Sauber 1:28.390 6. Mark Webber (Aus) Red Bull-Renault 1:28.417 7. Fernando Alonso (Spa) Renault 1:28.422 8. Jarno Trulli (Ita) Toyota 1:28.836 9. Nick Heidfeld (Ger) BMW Sauber 1:28.882 10. David Coulthard (GB) Red Bull-Renault 1:29.959 11. Nico Rosberg (Ger) Williams-Toyota 1:27.012 12. Rubens Barrichello (Brz) Honda 1:27.219 13. Jenson Button (GB) Honda 1:27.298 14. Sebastian Vettel (Ger) Toro Rosso-Ferrari 1:27.412 15. Timo Glock (Ger) Toyota 1:27.806 16. Kazuki Nakajima (Jpn) Williams-Toyota 1:27.547 17. Nelson Piquet Jr (Brz) Renault 1:27.568 18. Sebastien Bourdais (Fra) Toro Rosso-Ferrari 1:27.621 19. Giancarlo Fisichella (Ita) Force India-Ferrari 1:27.807 20. Adrian Sutil (Ger) Force India-Ferrari 1:28.325
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soubriquet
SJ'er with 5000+ posts
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Very happy with the Monaco result. Sutil/Force India must be gutted.
Staying up late to watch the race reminded me of times past. I used to watch them all, but the ex- hated me staying up 14 times per year, and used to give me heaps of grief. I stopped watching.
I don't get the grief any more. Anyone here get a bollocking for watching their sport?
_________________________
If you can`t fix it with a hammer, it`s an electrical fault.